Even with the moves I outline below, the O’s would obviously not be the favorite, and there are plenty of good reasons for that.
The Orioles would head to Spring Training picked no better than 3rd, 4th by many, and still last by some. None of the moves I outline below mean anything if the O’s do not get better production from the younger core. So let us start with that.
For the O’s to contend in ’11, I picture the following:
1) Markakis, Wieters, Jones, Reimold, Matusz, Arrieta, and Bergesen have to improve. Looking at each player individually, that seems realistic. Looking at them collectively, that is a lot to ask.
I understand that not all of the aforementioned players are going to step-up, that it just doesn’t work that way. I think Markakis can get back to his ’08 levels, but that remains to be seen. I think Wieters is capable of an .850 OPS season in ’11, but that has more to do with his Minor League production than anything else. I’d like to think that with 2 years of ML experience, and still several years from his likely prime; that he can make that jump. Still has to do it.
Jones has had 3 months with an OPS over .900 during the past two years, but numerous other months with below league average production. That is not even including his defense, which even if you are not a fan of UZR/150, has clearly not been as good as his reputation the past two seasons. Reimold is a personal favorite of mine, and I think he is closer to the .830 guy we saw his rookie year, but who knows? He is also 27, and has had less than 500 at-bats in the Majors. Maybe he is no better than a guy somewhere between his ’09, and ’10 seasons?
The pitching? All basically the same thing. I’d like to think the consistency shown by Matusz down the stretch will continue. I’d think Arrieta in his second year would be better than his rookie year, but his control will continue to be an issue. I’m confident that Bergesen is better than he showed in the first-half of 2010, not fully convinced he is quite as good as he showed in the second-half.
2) Roberts, Scott, and Guthrie have to avoid significant regression. Reynolds, and Hardy need to provide league average production at a minimum.
It is realistic to expect regression from Roberts, Guthrie, and Scott – the question is how much? Roberts health has to be an issue, as plenty of his game is built on speed. How well does his back hold-up? Does he lose any further range? I’m fairly confident that Guthrie will give another 190 ip, and keep the O’s in a lot of games. Scott? You’d have to expect he will regress from ’10, we will see how significantly. Part of my scenario had him moving to LF. If he has to go out there, how well does he play? Does that additional time in the field cause additional wear and tear that hurts him offensively?
League average production from Hardy and Reynolds is the expectation. Getting that would be a significant improvement over ’10 for the O’s.
3) Trade Tillman, Johnson, and Pie for Quentin and Floyd.
Hard to guess on trades. There are conflicting reports out of Chicago about the availability of Quentin and Floyd. By some reports the O’s could potentially give up less than I suggested. By some reports Quentin is not available at all. Quentin’s defense was horrific by UZR/150 the past two seasons. Prior to that he was fine. He dealt with a foot issue in 2009 that obviously would have impacted his range, and potentially his defense. No excuse to be found for his 2010 numbers though. I look at Floyd as a Guthrie type/clone. Fairly limited peripheral numbers that will give the O’s 200 innings and keep the team in games more often than not. I think Quentin is closer to his 2008 self vs. what we have seen the past two years, and that this is an opportunity to buy low.
If there is anything I dislike about my plan, it is trading Tillman.
4) The O’s sign Lee or LaRoche.
I believe according to Wins Above Replacement that the upgrade of Lee would be slightly more significant than LaRoche, but that either one would add roughly 2-3 WAR to the O’s lineup.
5) The O’s sign Rhodes, Feliciano, or Ohman as their 2nd lefty, The O’s also sign Gregg (or DelCarmen, or Peralta). Even if the O’s add several of these arms I am not expecting more than a win or so of improvement there.
Roberts 2nd
Markakis RF
Lee 1st
Scott LF
Quentin DH
Reynolds 3rd
Wieters C
Jones CF
Hardy SS
Tatum, Izturis, 2 of 4 of Reimold, Patterson, Harris, and Fox
Matusz, Guthrie, Floyd, Arrieta, Bergesen
Uehara
Gonzalez
Gregg or DelCarmen or Peralta
Berken
VandenHurk
Simon or Rule V pick Rosario
Rhodes or Feliciano or Ohman
Thoughts:
1) That lineup is 9 deep. If you can project a lineup with Wieters batting 7th, and Jones batting 8th you are in good shape.
Again, on the shown additions of Hardy, Reynolds, Lee/LaRoche, one of the five DH’s, and Scott to LF – I see that as 100 run improvement. That does not take into account increased production from Markakis, Jones, and Wieters. I would ask those reading this, do you find that realistic?
2) Just how good Matusz is in ’11 would go a long ways to determining the O’s chances. That is a capable rotation 1-5. The O’s had a 4.59 era in 2010. If the O’s were to drop that to 4.40 in ’11, that is another 35 run improvement.
3) I’m guessing that payroll is approaching $95M. That might be $10M more than the O’s are comfortable with.
4) I like that team to win 90 games, even in the AL East. Would be very surprised if they were not .500 at the absolute minimum.
The point I am looking to convey is that there is enough talent here that with a few additional (and fairly realistic) moves, that contention is possible this season.
As the O’s are today, without Lee or LaRoche, without one of the DH’s, and without Floyd or a similar starter; I think the O’s are somewhere between 77 and 85 wins. Where do you have the O’s as of today? Where would you have them with the projected moves above?
EDIT:
After I posted this, I saw a story from the Chicago Tribune quoting the White Sox’ General Mgr. Kenny Williams as stating the rumors about Quentin being available are untrue.
So that throws a kink in the initial plan. You could still sign Lee or LaRoche for 1st, move Scott to LF, and sign one of the DH’s (Vlad, Thome, Ordonez, Matsui). You could go with a rotation of Matusz, Guthrie, Arrieta, Bergesen, and Tillman; or you could trade Tillman, Johnson, Pie (among others) for another starter similar to Floyd.
Either way, you would wind-up with a similar roster talent wise.
















Chris,
You make a very compelling argument and one that I really want to believe as an Orioles fan, but as of this moment (realizing that it’s far too early to truly tell) I think the Orioles are closer to 75 wins than to 85. Adding Hardy and Reynolds are solid moves for the Orioles and baby steps in the right direction. That added 50 runs will be crucial for the O’s and who knows, if they can put together a compelling season this year maybe next offseason they can go out and spend for a big free agent like Prince Fielder.
I think your point is well taken, but it rests on a lot of ifs…too many to push the Orioles to 85 wins this year. Brian Roberts health really concerns me, relying on a young pitching staff for 162 games against the bats of Carl Crawford and Adrian Gonzalez, right now you have the think the Yankees stand the best chance of landing Cliff Lee. It’s a tough division for the young guys.
You also have to think that the Orioles will have a few injuries of their own. It happens to every team every year. Adam Jones only played 149 games last year, 119 in 2009. My big goal for him this year is to stay healthy all season.
While I do like their direction, love what Andy MacPhail has done and the Buck Showalter effect from last season, I think the AL East is stacked and that the Orioles just aren’t quite there to reach 85 wins. With that said, I am excited to see them play this season.
I think almost everyone would agree that the Orioles have already helped themselves and look to be a much improved team in ’11. How many wins that translates to is impossible to guess right now, but anything below 81 wins would be a disappointment.
The key to any success will come down to how well the pitching staff does. And the key to that is putting the best possible defense on the field to help them out.
And to me that means having a strong glove at first; someone who can make the other infielders look good. It also means having a quick, strong left fielder who can take away hits and extra bases.
So, that means to me that Luke Scott is the every day DH and gets limited time in the field. It’s not that he isn’t adequate in LF or even 1B, it’s that adequate is not good enough for this team.
I hope the Orioles get Adam LaRoche for first base. I heard today speculation is that his choice is the Nationals or the Orioles. If Showalter places a premium on defense, then they should get it done.
I agree with you 100% Chris. There are alot of reasons to be excited for the 2011 season and with a few breaks and improvements from the young core we could certainly contend if the right moves are made. I’m hoping Kenny Williams is just giving GM speak about Quentin because I’d love to get him and Floyd in that potential deal you mentioned. Maybe we can trade Tillman and Pie to Florida for Ricky Nolasco or something.
I think people are underestimating just how unlucky we were last year. Sure we were a very bad team but to have pretty much everybody regress isn’t something that usually happens. Theres too much talent in our young core and the pitchings too good to be that bad again. Theres still alot of time in the offseason to continue to improve and I think AM has something up his sleeve.
2012 is probably a better bet for contention but if the Yankees strike out on Cliff Lee and Andy Pettite (possibly losing him to retirement), we might have an outside shot. We’ll have to see how the rest of the offseason plays out but you have to like whats taken place so far.
I agree the Orioles are headed in the right direction, but they still have a long, long road to travel.
The moves so far – Reynolds, Hardy and Uehara – are just baby steps for a team that finished 30 games below .500.
Some quick thoughts:
- Yes, Buck Showalter got the team winning. The Orioles were 17-13 in September and October. But remember, it is not always wise to evaluate teams or players based on late season performance. Rosters are expanded. Some teams are out of it – and mailing it in.
- Free Agents. The Orioles have not demonstrated any ability to attract top-tier free agents. So the team is relegated to picking up the scraps. Maybe they will get lucky and get a Vlad Guerrero (vintage 2010) but that remains to be seen.
- Nick Markakis. To borrow from Bill Parcells – he is what he is. An average to slightly above average player. Those waiting for Markakis to fulfill star potential can stop waiting. It’s not going to happen. And it remains to be seen if Adam Jones will move up to the next level and become a force.
- The AL East. Baltimore needs to play both the Red Sox and Yankees 18 times per season. That’s close to one-quarter of the schedule against two juggernauts. The AL East was the only division in baseball to have four teams with 85 wins or more. I know the Rays are full of questions but Baltimore is in a tough division.
Let’s end on a positive note.
Showalter is a builder so look for steady progress. Maybe he can get Markakis, Jones and Reimold to improve. Luke Scott can hit. And the team has good building blocks in Matusz, Arrieta and Weiters.
Lastly, there are still two months to Spring Training. There’s still time for Andy McPhail to fill some holes so the Orioles are more competitive. Let’s see if he is up to the task.
- http://www.redsoxpost.com
Too early for me to decide on this one. Once the roster comes into sharper focus, I suppose I could make a better guess.
My initial impressions are that the O’s could certainly flirt with .500, maybe even field a winning club this season. But to contend? Not only would a lot of things have to go right, a lot of things would have to go wrong for the rest of the division.
Nice ideas. I would go after Laroche, Ordonez and Garza. Trade Riemold, Johnson, and a minor leaguer for Garza. I just don’t see Scott in LF.
Roberts
Markakis
Reynolds
Scott DH/1B
Ordonez DH/LF — Pie LF
Weiters
Jones
Hardy
Guthrie-Garza-Matusz-Arrietta-Tillman/Bergesen/Britton?